Science and Consciousness

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    • #11486

      Great discussion on consciousness and science. You rarely hear someone who can effectively challenge both James Corbett and Rupert Sheldrake.

      The book by Alex Tsakiris also looks interesting  – I find science getting it so wrong in so many important areas, including space.  Is it intentional or ignorance? Maybe a bit of both.

    • #11554
      Hobo Sapien

      That looks interesting, Morpheus, thank you. I’ll give it a listen later on tonight.

      Also wanted to share a 6min vid that turned up last night: The Mystery of Consciousness | Interview with Dr. Michael Clarage  on the Thunderbolts channel.

      Aaaand two of  my favorite books on the subject:

      The Mechanism of Mind, by Edward de Bono

      The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind, by Julian Jaynes

      I especially like the Jaynes book for clearly defining what he means by “consciousness” at the outset. It seems to me that a surprising number of authors neglect this step.

      Thanks again, cheers

    • #11555
      Dagny Taggart

      The Mystery of Consciousness | Interview with Dr. Michael Clarage

      This video landed in my email inbox four times this week. I can take the hint that it wants to be shared.

      • #11569

        Okay okay I can take the hint — two responses listing the same video in the same five-minute window!

        ThunderboltsProject is in my YouTube subscription list, but I happened not to have “caught up” in the last 36 hours or so, and had not seen it yet.

        I can see how very carefully and in baby-steps this group is taking its viewership forward into alternative material. Scientific materialists are put off very easily, and need to be spoon-fed information in easily digested doses. I am a big supporter of the effort and I hope that they can keep the bicycle standing up even as they pedal so slowly along. I wish them all the best, even as I wish that some of the more radical topics were addressed more quickly and thoroughly. To be fair, they’re doing this in the open and in public, and there is only so much they can do all at once without losing their audience.

        Huzzah and all that!

        • #11583
          Hobo Sapien

          Well said, Zen, but…. oh wait, I meant to say, “Yes, and…” ;-)

          Remember that the main push of the EU at this point is in the fields of physics, astrophysics, and cosmology; and their point is that EU theories are testable, falsifiable, and make accurate predictions, in contrast to the mathemagical phantasies so prevalent in these fields currently. I think they’re wise to be tentative in these other fields, holding out the possibility of new discoveries with new models – but the truth is, not enough of the science is being done yet to put it on the same footing as the astrophysics. The last EU conference had some very intriguing talks on the subject though; they’re on youtube.

          I recall several years ago, the Thunderbolts Project started a forum – I was one of the first to sign up. Surprisingly fast it was flooded with people asserting as undeniable fact vague theories beyond the realm of the physical, to the point that I gave up on it. Don’t know if it still exists.

          In short, I think the Thunderbolts team is close to an optimal path on this.

          • #11590

            I think the Thunderbolts team is close to an optimal path on this.

            Indeed, I never meant to imply that they were not doing just what they should be. I admire their efforts greatly and I value their work, all of them. Imagine what might be accomplished if the basis of scientific exploration can be re-founded in a proper understanding of the role of electricity & magnetism in all phenomena. It would be epic.

            I’m just impatient. I’m the kid in class who is thinking “Ok, I get it… so then what?” If Mars, Venus, Saturn, and maybe more planets were aligned in the polar configuration within the period of human history, what does that mean for our axis of rotation? for the length of our orbit? What about Ley lines, are they “real”? Are “chi” meridians real?

            It’s the result of recent shift in my own perceptual framework, and not their fault in any way. I’m sure their doing all they can. Peace.

            • #11594
              Hobo Sapien

              Ah yes, the gifted student itching for more. I sympathize with that; it got me into a lot of trouble in 2nd grade because I was so bored.  I learned to read in first grade, by 2nd grade I had come up with my own method of speed reading and was devouring books; I’d also discovered the public library – can you say, “in heaven”? Some classic films were coming out at the time, like Mysterious Island and War of the Worlds – couldn’t watch them on tv (past my bedtime) but I was tortured by the commercials for the airings in earlier programming. So I walked the 2 blocks to the library in our village and found the original novels. Yeah, in 2nd grade I was reading Jules Verne, HG Wells, Edgar Rice Burroughs, Robert Louis Stevenson… I learned to look for the word, “unabridged.” I was tested by the school, they said I was reading at 6th grade level with 100% comprehension and retention, but my parents wouldn’t let me skip some grades.

              So I feel your pain. Let me share a few things I’ve come up with to scratch the itch, re: EU. I like reading Mythology, looking for signs of catastrophic events – the story of Zeus’ battle with Typhon is a good place to start, I think you’ll find it evocative. Also read Ignatius Donnelly‘s Ragnarok: The Age of Fire and Gravel, All of his works are available over at And If you haven’t yet read this, might I suggest Michael Crichton’s Travels – for sure you’ll find some things to chew on there. :-) Paleontology is also fun to explore – I’m working up a post for the EU thread here with some interesting EU connections with current research on the Permian Extinction.

              Please don’t let me put you on the defensive, such is not my intent.

              Peace, brutha

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